Latest post Sun, Aug 29 2021 8:02 AM by Pat Horridge. 16 replies.
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  • Tue, Jun 8 2021 5:40 PM

    • Polar-Bear
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    The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Hi there

    Anyone else having system crashes (panics causing black screens and restarting) with the iMac 2020 (Model 20,1 / 3.8 GHz 8-core i7 / 5500XT)?

    As an assistant editor I came across 3 of these units in different facilities / with different editors and all of them were not able to run Media Composer 2020/2021 without kernal panics occuring on a regular basis (multiple times a day)!

    All of these iMacs were connected to one external display eigther via a USB-C to HDMI cable or a USB-C to DisplayPort cable. Also they all have different and sufficient RAM configurations. It happens on Catalina as well as the latest version of Big Sur.

    Unplugging the secondary display seems to be a workaround as well as driving it by an external GPU (RX580 in a Sonnet enclosure in one case). 

    Strangely enough, MC doesn't have to run intensive tasks to crash the computer. Sometimes it happens while sitting idle or even on launching MC. But it never happens when MC isn't running at all. Sadly no other NLE is installed on these systems to provoke the crash outside of MC.

    As this is a machine recommended by Avid I think it's worth discussing the problem in this forum as I see more editors buying this (probably last) Intel iMac and then facing this issue wich basically makes the machine unusable. 

    Cheers, Lars

    16-Core Mac Pro, 192 GB Ram, W5700X, Catalina 10.15.7, MediaComposer 2021.5, Resolve Studio 17 [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Jun 8 2021 8:37 PM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Raise a support case with Avid and see what they say?

    I presume like a PC you can set a setting to prevent the  restarting and see what the error is or a log that will show what the error was that caused this.

    On a PC I'd be running stress tests of the RAM and hardware components. Is the RAM all genuine Apple RAM? Its often not.

    HP Z840 3.1GHZ 20cores 128GB RAM M4000 GPU 1TB NVMe drive HP Z book 17 G2 2.7GHZ Quad core 32GB RAM Nvidia K3100M 1TB SSD drive ACI Moderator. I'm... [view my complete system specs]

     

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  • Wed, Jun 9 2021 2:47 PM In reply to

    • jef
    • Top 25 Contributor
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    This problem interests me as I have been considering the purchase of a similar system but with the optional i9 processor. I wonder if any readers of this thread have that model and if so, have they had any issues. 

    Also ...

    Polar-Bear:

     Sadly no other NLE is installed on these systems to provoke the crash outside of MC.

    ... that sentence confused me.  Did you mean there are no other NLEs on the systems at all or (for example) Premiere will not cause the problem.

    Thanks,

    Jef

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2021 iMac w Big Sur [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Wed, Jun 9 2021 3:13 PM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Be interesting to know if its only MC or other NLEs but its not that relevant if you need MC to work.

    There are a lot of these systems in use and very few (I've not heard of any) issue reported that follow this so I'd suspect a hardware issue or a software conflict. 

    At the Application level Avid shouldn't be ablle to cause that sort of kardware crash there is an OS in the way to trap that sort of thing. If Avid goes bonkers the OS raises the quit application termination box.

    So its far more likley Avid is asking the OS to ask hardware to do something that the OS thinks is ok (and that no other NLE asks) that then causes a hardware crash.

    Display drivers and RAM issues are typical culprits. Older Macs can se their thermal heatsink dry out causing local over heating. But there are endless potential issues.

    ON a PC you get a stop interupt blue screen but you at least get a code and can goodle potential causes.

    HP Z840 3.1GHZ 20cores 128GB RAM M4000 GPU 1TB NVMe drive HP Z book 17 G2 2.7GHZ Quad core 32GB RAM Nvidia K3100M 1TB SSD drive ACI Moderator. I'm... [view my complete system specs]

     

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    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet-training.co.uk | W www.vet-training.co.uk |

     

  • Wed, Jun 9 2021 7:41 PM In reply to

    • Polar-Bear
    • Not Ranked
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    • Posts 9
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    jef:

    Polar-Bear:

     Sadly no other NLE is installed on these systems to provoke the crash outside of MC.

    ... that sentence confused me.

    There are no other NLEs installed. Maybe when I find the time I could try Premiere on one system.

    Pat Horridge:

    ... restarting and see what the error is or a log that will show ...

    There are log files wich all start with "panic (cpu 1 caller 0xffffff ...)"

    Pat Horridge:

    ... stress tests of the RAM and hardware components. Is the RAM all genuine Apple RAM?

    I ran the Apple hardware test. No problems found. The RAM configurations are all different. We tried every possible configuration: Apple RAM only, Kingston RAM only, mixed configurations, we also tried leaving every second slot empty. 

    Pat Horridge:

    ... There are a lot of these systems in use and very few (I've not heard of any) issue reported that follow this so I'd suspect a hardware issue or a software conflict. 

    Well as I said: I've seen 3 units of this machine (i7, 5500XT) and all of them have the same issue. So in my experience it's failiure rate is at a 100%. 
    Pat Horridge:
    Display drivers and RAM issues are typical culprits. Older Macs can se their thermal heatsink dry out causing local over heating. But there are endless potential issues.
    All units were brand new and started shipping in 2020. But some good news: Another editor owns a 2020-Model similar to the nasty one and it's noly difference is the GPU: 5700XT. So the issue seems to occure only on the 5500XT models.
    16-Core Mac Pro, 192 GB Ram, W5700X, Catalina 10.15.7, MediaComposer 2021.5, Resolve Studio 17 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 9 2021 8:04 PM In reply to

    • jef
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Polar-Bear:

    But some good news: Another editor owns a 2020-Model similar to the nasty one and it's noly difference is the GPU: 5700XT. So the issue seems to occure only on the 5500XT models.

    Excellent sleuthing!  I know little about AMD GPUs, but does AMD have a website where you can get GPU drivers for Mac?  NVIDIA did this (back when there was no war between NVIDIA and Apple).

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2021 iMac w Big Sur [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Wed, Jun 9 2021 9:48 PM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    I just did a Google search for:

    apple 5500XT GPU crashes

    And it came up with loads of articles on crashes with a whole range of products like photoshop etc.

    So it quite possible that's the issue.

    It coukd be the driver or the actual hardware. 

    HP Z840 3.1GHZ 20cores 128GB RAM M4000 GPU 1TB NVMe drive HP Z book 17 G2 2.7GHZ Quad core 32GB RAM Nvidia K3100M 1TB SSD drive ACI Moderator. I'm... [view my complete system specs]

     

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  • Wed, Jun 16 2021 9:43 PM In reply to

    • jef
    • Top 25 Contributor
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Well Pat's Googling sent me down a rabbit hole ....

    It does look as if there might be some issue with this iMac and second monitors not just related to Avid.  And it also seems that upgrading to the 5700XT GPU just gets you a different (but not as bad) set of issues.  Too bad as this does look like a good all around Mac (M1 aside).

    I would hope the OP has brought this up with Apple and would love to know their response.

    Jef

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2021 iMac w Big Sur [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Thu, Jun 17 2021 8:42 AM In reply to

    • Hansa
    • Top 500 Contributor
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    We've just placed an order for 20 of these 27" iMacs and switched away from the 5500XT to the 5700 after reading this thread. Please someone out there give me some good news about the 5700 and MC. We will be using second monitors and that's why we switched at the last moment.

    This is not good for my sanity looking forward to an autumn of pain.

    Avid DNxIO, 2.7 GHz 12 core late 2013 Mac Pro, 64 GB Ram, MC 2020.12 Ultimate, OS 10.14.6, LaCie 24 TB RAID. 3.5 GHz 6 core late 2013 Mac Pros x 5, MC... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Jun 17 2021 9:59 AM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    I'd take delivery of one and do throurgh testing before accepting the remaining 19.

    HP Z840 3.1GHZ 20cores 128GB RAM M4000 GPU 1TB NVMe drive HP Z book 17 G2 2.7GHZ Quad core 32GB RAM Nvidia K3100M 1TB SSD drive ACI Moderator. I'm... [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  Avid Certified Instructor VET

     

    QC/QAR Training - Understanding Digital Media - Advanced Files * Compression - Avid Ingest - PSE fixing courses and more

    All bespoke and delivered onsite at yours. Or delivered via hosted Zoom session.

     

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  • Fri, Jun 18 2021 3:47 PM In reply to

    • Polar-Bear
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Mon, Dec 28 2020
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Hansa:

    We've just placed an order for 20 of these 27" iMacs and switched away from the 5500XT to the 5700 after reading this thread.

    Ok well then we defenatly would have had clarity about the serial issue Big Smile Glad that we could prevent that :)

    An editor I know has one with the 5700 and doesn't have this issue. However there is another minor issue that is not especially related to the iMac but to workstations without an IO device like the blackmagic decklink / mini monitors: After hiding MC using cmd + h, doing some research in safari for example, then returning via cmd + tab, MC tends to freezes . Sometimes for some seconds, sometimes it doesn't show up again and you would have to crash it. 

    It happens to me (on a Mac Pro with BM mini monitor 4K) as well when I switch the HW/SW toggle to output audio via the OS rather than the IO card. But strangely enough it only happened with an Apogee Duet 2 connected and selected as the sound card. With my Mackie Big Knob Studio I never had this problem...

    On his iMac the editor has this problem without any sound card connected to it... But actually this would be worth another post :)

    If you have this problem maybe it will be an idea to experiment with an external sound card (like the Big Knob) or an IO card.

    Cheers.

    16-Core Mac Pro, 192 GB Ram, W5700X, Catalina 10.15.7, MediaComposer 2021.5, Resolve Studio 17 [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Jul 8 2021 1:08 AM In reply to

    • jef
    • Top 25 Contributor
    • Joined on Sun, Feb 26 2006
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Well, I will get to play with this as I just ordered a refurb iMac.  BUT, it has the i9 proc and the 16GB maxed out GPU.  From what I have seen, this MIGHT not have the issue (but possibly others .....).  I intend to run a secondary UI monitor.  We shall see.

    Jef

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2021 iMac w Big Sur [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Wed, Jul 21 2021 3:20 PM In reply to

    • jef
    • Top 25 Contributor
    • Joined on Sun, Feb 26 2006
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    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    This is a big OT but related.

    What are people using to connect their external monitors to iMacs?  I am looking at the OWC TB3 > Display Port adapter.  Generally good reviews.  The external monitor is older and displayport is the best it can see.

    Thanks,

    Jef

    EDIT:  I see that some are using USB - C to Display Port cables.  I guess I was wondering if this might be related to the issues discussed on Apple forums.

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2021 iMac w Big Sur [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Tue, Aug 3 2021 7:43 PM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics

    Hi there, I have the exact same issue with my i9 IMac 2020 5500XT, really annoying. I just went last week to the Apple Store and they changed the complete Motherboard (LMB?). But the issue still exists. I tried all kinds of things: changed the RAM, tried different USB-C to HDMI Cables or Adapters and tried it with different OS or Avid Versions - no change, after 10-15 min. of just having media composer open, the machine crashes. It makes complete sense to me that this is a problem of the GPU.

    This making the machine not useable for editing, only transcoding without a second screen works quite well...

  • Tue, Aug 3 2021 7:55 PM In reply to

    Re: The iMac 27" (2020) and its kernel panics


    Hi there,

    I have the exact same issue with my i9 IMac 2020 5500XT, really annoying. I just went last week to the Apple Store and they changed the complete Motherboard (LMB?). But the issue still exists. I tried all kinds of things: changed the RAM, tried different USB-C to HDMI Cables or Adapters and tried it with different OS or Avid Versions - no change, after 10-15 min. of just having media composer open, the machine crashes. It makes complete sense to me that this is a problem of the GPU.

    This making the machine not useable for editing, only transcoding without a second screen works quite well...

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