Latest post Fri, Aug 13 2010 8:48 AM by Jeroen van Eekeres. 51 replies.
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  • Wed, Feb 17 2010 10:53 PM

    • luca.mg
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    One year has past...

    I welcomed the birth of the chat with Avid forum as a good opportunity to link with the company, roughly one year has past since the chat with Avid debut, enough time to tell if this is a useful thing or not... after reading the last round of replies from Kirk Arnold I am very disappointed: as in the previous batches of replies it's corporate talking, it seems like she's talking to investors or stock holders (or to prospective ones), not to customers, emphasizing the company's achievments and praising the products, defending the company's policies and approaching us as potential customers rather than existing and demanding ones: there's no need to try to convince me that Avid is the maker of the finest NLE on the market, I already bought the editor, I post here asking for overall improvements, not to be reassured that I made the right purchasing decision, and that the best has yet to come, but it's coming; the replies seem to address any given question without taking into any consideration the following debate, which widens the question and asks for a more in depth answer; very short answers for very long threads, and too many "I can't disclose, but stay tuned" kind of replies: this is the chat with Avid forum but Avid can't chat. Take the answer to the six pages long Avatar thread for example: the posts were underlining the need to improve advertising, marketing and communication but only the very first post has been answerd, being the answer "...it's not easy and it takes more time than we would like ... thank You for Your passion ... we are honoured that Avatar was made using Avid solutions and we are excited about the press we received as part of the media coverage of the movie...we'll have more on it...": not a single word on the need for better advertising and marketing as discussed in the thread. Avid, are You going through the all thread or just superficially reading, and answering, only the first post? If You have no time to spare for reading and properly answer please do not wind us all up and close this forum; honestly, I appreciate the idea behind this forum but after one year of activity it seems now obvious that even if Kirk Arnold says that she's willing to chat she really doesn't, or can't do it; my expectations are frustrated, I'm not even expecting a satisfactory answer to my rant, but I had to get this off my chest. Like in the old, pre new-thinking/chat-with-Avid days I'll wait for NAB, the once in a year only occasion to know what's up at Avid and chat, if one happens to be at the show; and forget about the chat with Avid misleading forum.

    Symphony 2018.12.3, BM Intensity Pro 4k, Windows 10, i7-5930K, 32 GB ram, Quadro K620 [view my complete system specs]

    peace luca

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 6:44 AM In reply to

    • Jayanta
    • Top 75 Contributor
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    Re: One year has past...

    I also read Kirk's replies. Agree with You fully.

    All Sorts of System as I am a freelance Editor [view my complete system specs]

    "Out of mud the lovely Lotus Blooms, Out of Strife something higher vies "

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 7:11 AM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    luca.mg:
    my expectations are frustrated,
    Mine as well.

     

    That said outside this forum the level and quality of Avid participation in the forums has IMO improved dramatically over the last 12 months. Without naming names over the last few months we have regularly seen senior engineers, people responsible for writing the code behind some of the new features actively involving themselves in threads related to their areas of expertise.  This level of participation has exceeded my expectaions and I find it very refreshing.

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 9:22 AM In reply to

    • luca.mg
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    Re: One year has past...

    AndrewAction:
    the level and quality of Avid participation in the forums has IMO improved dramatically over the last 12 months. Without naming names over the last few months we have regularly seen senior engineers, people responsible for writing the code behind some of the new features actively involving themselves in threads related to their areas of expertise.  This level of participation has exceeded my expectaions and I find it very refreshing.
    To be fully honest and fair I agree with that, I also appreciate very much to see many people from engineering participating and sharing knowledge at a fast pace, and there's not another company I know of that is running a chat with the management forum, while talking of marketing Avid should really capitalize on the great value of the forums, except for the disappointing chat with Avid one ;-), as the forums are unique quality wise and a source of really useful technical info for the customers. The thing with the chat with Avid pages is that it is a one way chat: we can write whatever we like, and this is great, but the management doesn't enjoy the same level of freedom in answering; when it comes to software issues there's already the feature request forum, but talking of anything else leads to polite answers with no real content; all I can say is that the chat word is misleading, maybe the forum should be called "users feedback": I wouldn't expect for straight answers and wouldn't be disappointed with the laconic replies. Now let's see how fast the answer is to the Liquid replacement thread and the deepness of the answer itself, the Liquid users do not want smoke in the eyes, they've had enough of it, and can't be satisfied with a "trust us we're working on it" reply, as much as they're happy now because have been finally heard they'll get mad with an evasive reply, and there's nothing worst than negative word of mouth in this economy for a company such as Avid.

    Symphony 2018.12.3, BM Intensity Pro 4k, Windows 10, i7-5930K, 32 GB ram, Quadro K620 [view my complete system specs]

    peace luca

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 1:42 PM In reply to

    • switthaus
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    Re: One year has past...

    AndrewAction:
    This level of participation has exceeded my expectaions and I find it very refreshing.

     

    I agree with "Andrew" on this one (alert the media!).  There are very few user forums where the COO will answer questions of the general user base.  Having Kirk Arnold address some issues versus some mid-level manager is extremely nice and should be acknowledged as such.  Now, her hands are a bit tied on what she can say about the future by the fact Avid is a publicly traded company.  However, enough hints are getting out that I am generally excited about going to NAB this year.  I hope Avid keeps turning the "purple ship" around to the right direction and has started that turn in time.

     

    Scott

    Scott Witthaus

    Owner/Editor/Post Production Supervisor 1708 Editorial

    http://vimeopro.com/1708editorial/1708-editorial

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 2:35 PM In reply to

    • jwrl
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    Re: One year has past...

    switthaus:
    ... and has started that turn in time.
    I feel more positive about that than I did this time last year.  Fingers crossed, and hope.

    MC 7.0.4 - Asus P6T Deluxe V2 mobo - Intel i7 920 2.66GHz - Windows 7 Ult64 SP1 - nVidia Quadro FX 1800 - 16 Gbyte low latency DDR3 RAM - Internal 8 Tb... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 5:54 PM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    AndrewAction:
    That said outside this forum the level and quality of Avid participation in the forums has IMO improved dramatically over the last 12 months.

    I agree as well.

    luca.mg:
    The thing with the chat with Avid pages is that it is a one way chat: we can write whatever we like, and this is great, but the management doesn't enjoy the same level of freedom in answering...

    And that's the core issue of this thread, and the thing that makes it appear to be a one way channel - us to them. As has been pointed out, we are users, not potential new customers. We already own and believe in the product. We don't need pre-approved "corporate speak" posted here in response. If management's hands are tied that tightly behind their backs about what they can and cannot say, then this particular Forum venue's value is questionable.

    switthaus:
    However, enough hints are getting out that I am generally excited about going to NAB this year.

    And another part of the problem is that NAB only happens once a year and seems to be the only time Avid is free to make major announcements about it's product line. But what about the rest of the calendar year outside of NAB and IBC? There need to be additional high profile promotional events held at other times as well. The only example of this I can remember was the release of MC 3.0 and the DX architecture in June of 2008 in multiple cities, including here in DC. As many of us have pointed out before, successful marketing is all about HIGH VISIBILITY and PROMOTION. The movie business has this concept nailed. Six months before release, start tantalizing, building anticipation and whetting appetites of what is to come by releasing subtle details and hints. Then, as the release date grows closer, the frequency of promotions increases, with additional details released that continue to build anticipation without "showing your hand" to your competition.

    Again, as many of us have said before, Avid needs to become pro-actively aggressive in it's marketing efforts to seek out, attract and gain new customers to improve it's market share. Banners on a web page are a good start, but are insufficient by themselves. Avid needs to be more visible and active in promotions all year long, not just at trade shows like NAB and IBC. More events like the roll out of 3.0 are needed, with face to face human interaction and the hands on experience you can't get on the web.

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    Larry Rubin

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  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 6:35 PM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    I also agree with all points made so far.  

    To expand on what Larry is saying about the hands on and face-to-face interaction that is needed all year.  One of the things we do at the Boston Avid User Group is each May we have a NAB Wrap-Up meeting.  It's proven to be a great venue for our Group to get a first-hand look at some of the new toys and talk directly with Avid personnel (not senior management) about the new tools and where things might be going technology wise in the future.  Beyond that, throughout the year we have various product demos and case studies to showcase how people in our area are using these tools.  

    I'm always surprised by the number of people within our own User Group who are unaware of some of Avid's recent advancements, they often find out about features that have existed for a few versions when they see one of these case studies.  

    I'm also a member of an Avid Group on LinkedIN and just the other day someone said they were doing a research paper about whether or not Avid's recent re-branding and product lineup change has been effective or not.  One of the first comments was "I was unaware that Avid attempted to rebrand it's image and I'm a daily Avid user, so perhaps it wasn't too successful?"  

     

     

     

    Kenton VanNatten | Avid Editor (for hire)

    "I am not obsessed... I'm detail-oriented"

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 6:39 PM In reply to

    • gumbaedit
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    Re: One year has past...

    Thankfully, though, new versions seem to be on a 5 to 7 month delivery schedule, which helps immensely in letting us know if Avid is listening to our concerns, requests and feedback.  NAB falls just about 7 months since MC v4's release.  Looking forward to it.

    6 core Late 2013 MacPro 3.0 gHz, 16 gigs RAM, MC 8.8.5 on OSX 10.12.4, DNxIO, Flanders CM250, BMD Desktop Video version 10.9.1 [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 7:33 PM In reply to

    • switthaus
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    Re: One year has past...

    gumbaedit:
    Thankfully, though, new versions seem to be on a 5 to 7 month delivery schedule, which helps immensely in letting us know if Avid is listening to our concerns, requests and feedback.  NAB falls just about 7 months since MC v4's release.

    This is a good point.  Avid has moved away from timing a big release just to hit NAB, as many times half-baked software was the result.  With this new schedule, we get releases thoughout the year and if one lands on NAB or IBC, the better for attendees.  NAB and IBC are buzz generators for our industry.  Notice how the Apple (pro-apps) buzz has faded a bit?  Half-step releases and no presence at the major trade shows will add to that.  Avid has a chance to recapture some momentum.

    Actually, IMHO, an Avid presence at trade shows and regional events like Kenton mentions,  is far more important than telling me that "Avatar" was cut on it.  At least at a trade show/event, I can see the product, talk to employees, ask questions that are relevant to my clients and workflow, versus anything about Avatar!

     

    sw

    Scott Witthaus

    Owner/Editor/Post Production Supervisor 1708 Editorial

    http://vimeopro.com/1708editorial/1708-editorial

  • Thu, Feb 18 2010 8:51 PM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    Wow.. now that's a thread with a lot of very good points.

    Although the 6 months upgrade path gives us a better insight in the direction, it's nothing more then again reading "the message on the wall". Without Avid pointing out on a regular basis where they believe the market is going and in which way they think they need to adapt the product line, making assumptions on future developments based on past to present upgrade paths is again nothing more then speculation.

    For example: Where did the upgrade path of Xpress Pro guide us towards its EOL?

    I honestly hoped that the letter of Gary Greenfield of almost 2 years ago and the start of the Chat with Avid forum would change the long time silent attitude of Avid. While participation on the forum of a number of Avid Employees has increased a lot, the CEO/marketing silence is still present.

    If the recent posts of Kirk are not an incident and are followed up by more regular posts with content then my hope could be restored.

     

    From the old Apple Quadro 950 to HP Z8xx. My current own system: 1x Z420 E5 1650 16GB memory, 128GB SSD, 1x XW8600, 2x 3.0Ghz Quadcore, 12GB memory... [view my complete system specs]

    Jeroen van Eekeres 

    Technical director, Broadcast support engineer, Avid ACSR.

     

    Always have a backup of your projects....Always!!!! Yes Always!!!!

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  • Fri, Feb 19 2010 12:48 PM In reply to

    • switthaus
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    Re: One year has past...

    jveekeres:
    For example: Where did the upgrade path of Xpress Pro guide us towards its EOL?

    MC Soft @ $2495.  And this was a smart move to consolidate, as the fractured Avid product line was not doing anyone any good.  Avid needs to do the same with symphony and MC....too close to be separate products at separate prices.  M

    jveekeres:

    If the recent posts of Kirk are not an incident and are followed up by more regular posts with content then my hope could be restored.

    As stated, there is only so much she can say about looking forward due to the fact that Avid is a publicly traded company.  Plus, we are getting the COO responding to some of these posts.  That in itself is very refreshing.

     

    Scott Witthaus

    Owner/Editor/Post Production Supervisor 1708 Editorial

    http://vimeopro.com/1708editorial/1708-editorial

  • Fri, Feb 19 2010 2:15 PM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    switthaus:
    the fractured Avid product line was not doing anyone any good.  Avid needs to do the same with symphony and MC....too close to be separate products at separate prices

    And harkening back to the massive Liquid Replacement thread, they need to figure out what to do with Liquid and Pinnacle Studio.  

    Kenton VanNatten | Avid Editor (for hire)

    "I am not obsessed... I'm detail-oriented"

  • Fri, Feb 19 2010 2:42 PM In reply to

    Re: One year has past...

    switthaus:

    jveekeres:
    For example: Where did the upgrade path of Xpress Pro guide us towards its EOL?

    MC Soft @ $2495.  And this was a smart move to consolidate, as the fractured Avid product line was not doing anyone any good.  Avid needs to do the same with symphony and MC....too close to be separate products at separate prices.  M

    Scott, I think you are missing my point. I agree that the integration was a smart move. (I would have kept FreeDV but that's another topic)

    At the time of Xpress pro's existence the prices of MC were much much higher. I personally upgraded XpressDV to Xpress pro HD and later MC3. From the version upgrade path of Xpress pro (version 4.x, 5.x and 5.5.x) I never got the message that Xpress pro would be EOL soon regardless if I liked the software only move.

    You could be right about the integration of MC and Symphony but how van we distill that from MC's upgrade path?

    switthaus:
    As stated, there is only so much she can say about looking forward due to the fact that Avid is a publicly traded company.  Plus, we are getting the COO responding to some of these posts.  That in itself is very refreshing.

    It is... but I found the letter of CEO Gray Greenfield much more "refreshing". I would like such letters on a regular basis. They don't give any info on which version will come with which features but they would give an insight into where Avid thinks the market is going.

     

    From the old Apple Quadro 950 to HP Z8xx. My current own system: 1x Z420 E5 1650 16GB memory, 128GB SSD, 1x XW8600, 2x 3.0Ghz Quadcore, 12GB memory... [view my complete system specs]

    Jeroen van Eekeres 

    Technical director, Broadcast support engineer, Avid ACSR.

     

    Always have a backup of your projects....Always!!!! Yes Always!!!!

    A.V.I.D....... Another Version In Development

    www.mediaoffline.com

     

     

     

  • Fri, Feb 19 2010 3:36 PM In reply to

    • switthaus
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    Re: One year has past...

    jveekeres:
    You could be right about the integration of MC and Symphony but how van we distill that from MC's upgrade path?

    I am not sure what you mean by this.  MC is MC and you choose the IO from Avid you want to hang on the backe end.  Same with Symphony.  My feeling is that Avid should boil it's post offerings down to two products, MC/Symph and DS and make them work perfecdtly together.  Then there is no questions about feature sets or upgrades. 

     

    Scott Witthaus

    Owner/Editor/Post Production Supervisor 1708 Editorial

    http://vimeopro.com/1708editorial/1708-editorial

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