Latest post Sat, Apr 24 2010 3:33 PM by OliverPeters. 104 replies.
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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:33 PM In reply to

    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    editdudes:

    I can appreciate that, even if most of the new stuff unfortunately has little or no impact on the grading and finishing work we do on the Symphony.

    Avid's strict vow of secrecy causes a lot of frustration, and it's a pity that you guys don't realize the benefits of having an open dialogue with your customers.

     

    So you don't think RGB, direct QT access and native Red access will not affect your online and conforming business?

    editdudes:
    that you guys don't realize the benefits of having an open dialogue with your customers.

    I disagree. I am not sure what medium you are referring to but Avid, especially in this forum, has been very open.

     

    MC 8.6.1, Windows 10, ASROCK X99M, Intel 5930K, Zotac GTX970, 32GB RAM, Transcend 512GB M.2 SSD & Dell U2713H. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt, OSX 10.10.5, MC... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:36 PM In reply to

    • jakeheat
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    So if no additional R&D has gone into the software for Symphony v.5 should there really be a premium on the upgrade?

    Media Composer 2019.8.0 MacPro 6 core - 64 GB RAM - OS:10.14.6 3.33Ghz iMacs, Macbook Pros. BM UltraStudio 4K Extreme v11.3 After Effects, etc [view my complete system specs]

    @jaketheeditor 

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:55 PM In reply to

    • jakeheat
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    Dom Q. Silverio:
    So you don't think RGB, direct QT access and native Red access will not affect your online and conforming business?

    95 percent of my stuff is supplied on HDCam SR or Digibeta, so no, at the moment these things don't really effect me.

    What us Online guys have an issue with is Avids neglect of non-(offline)editing development. You know, once the material is cut, this is normally where we come in - so things like advances to the grading tool (already discussed(many times)) would be most appreciated. Dual link HDSDI is great and it's probably a big enough deal for us to upgrade our Symphony Nitris box - but as for the software side of things, there is nothing for me that has improved onlining.

    Media Composer 2019.8.0 MacPro 6 core - 64 GB RAM - OS:10.14.6 3.33Ghz iMacs, Macbook Pros. BM UltraStudio 4K Extreme v11.3 After Effects, etc [view my complete system specs]

    @jaketheeditor 

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:56 PM In reply to

    • Neil J
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    Jake

    I don't believe the pricing has been released but it would be very disappointing to see premium pricing on Symphony v5. After all the price point of a new Symphony system is still out of the ball park when you look at the almost identical MC + Nitris DX combi.

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:57 PM In reply to

    • Tim
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    this is interesting for me as to what Oliverpeters says about 'FCP-like timeline editing' now in MC5, as I am coming from Liquid & before that I did use FCPv3 years ago both professionally and now for the past 2 years using xpress pro 566, I've actually come to really like the Avid style of editing I'm not sure if I like the drag and drop style editing anymore, having editing like that for some years I think I'll stick to the avid style now, I never liked it at first but now I love it!

    each to their own! what ever works for ya!

     

     

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 3:58 PM In reply to

    • BLKDOG
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    Let's not start speculating on pricing please. Nothing has been decided upon or communicated to us yet so let's wait until we hear the plan before panicking.

    Project Manager, Avid Professional Services - Americas [view my complete system specs]

    In agreement, Unity. In Disagreement, Discussion. In all things, Charity.


  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:02 PM In reply to

    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    cohort:

    each to their own! what ever works for ya!

    And having that kind of flexibility in approach and techniques is exactly what makes Avid great. Out of multiple techniques possible, use the one you are most comfortable with. It's nice to see accommodations made for the "drag and drop" crowd, although I will not be among them, being the die-hard keyboard fanatic that I am. Although, I have adopted a "best of both worlds" approach to both the mouse and the keyboard.

    Newscutter Nitris DX 9.5.3.5 * Media Composer 5.5.3.6 (At Home on PC running XP Pro) * Symphony 6.5.2.1 (At home on MacBook Pro3,1 running 10.7.2) * Interplay... [view my complete system specs]

    Larry Rubin

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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:19 PM In reply to

    • OliverPeters
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    cohort:
    I've actually come to really like the Avid style of editing I'm not sure if I like the drag and drop style editing anymore

     It's a selectable feature. You can toggle various of the contextual timeline tools on/off.

    - Oliver

     

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:20 PM In reply to

    • editdudes
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    BLKDOG:

    We have more opportunities now for direct customer engagement than ever before in the history of the company.

    What we cannot do is go in the face of SEC regulatory laws put in place after the Enron debacle.

    No argument there, but I'd be very interested in a link to some legal document explaining why you can't even answer questions about what major bugs are on your short list, or if we can expect CC masks in Symphony within a time frame of one, five or ten years. I'm sorry, but if this is what SEC is really about, then something is seriously wrong.

    Ask us anything and we wil do our leve best to get an answer for you. However, on an open forum it is legally impossible for us to lay out the develpment schedule for products annd features not yet released.

    I think you may need to revise your statement to "it's a pity that you guys don't realize the benefits of having an open dialog with me".

    I'm a bit baffled by this, and I fail to see how Apple and others can circumvent these laws if you can't.

    Sharing information about certain bug fixes or relatively minor feature changes in a product can't be against the law. Doesn't it seem crazy to you at all?

    I'd be more than happy to revise my statement if i can find a good enough reason to do so, and you might also consider the possibility that there might be more than a few customers sharing these opinions.

    Please remember that we're trying to make a living here with the help of your products and others. That's the bottom line and the only reason we're on this forum. Getting info from our local rep unfortunately is a joke...

     

    Thank you!

     

     

    Symphony Nitris DX • MC Adrenaline DNxcel 5.5 • DaVinci Resolve • VirtualDub :) [view my complete system specs]

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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:33 PM In reply to

    • BLKDOG
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    editdudes:
    I'd be very interested in a link to some legal document explaining why you can't even answer questions about what major bugs are on your short list, or if we can expect CC masks in Symphony within a time frame of one, five or ten years

    Here you go. This is the legal restraint on discussing unreleased features in US law. I'm not interested in debating any interpretations for this legal decision. Suffice to say that the people who sign our checks each week tell us how it will be interpreted.

    Apple cannot circumvent this and does not. Did you follow the iPad run up? Absolutely NO communication from Apple about the features until release. There was loads of speculation "leaks" and online discussion but, officially, silence from the company itself.

     

    editdudes:
    Doesn't it seem crazy to you at all?

    Welcome to the American regulatory system.

    Project Manager, Avid Professional Services - Americas [view my complete system specs]

    In agreement, Unity. In Disagreement, Discussion. In all things, Charity.


  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:40 PM In reply to

    • Abeyta
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    My 2 cents,

    MC5 looks awesome. Nice to see some very much needed workflows addressed. Great Job!

    However, very disappointed that Symphony didn't get any special updates. As a matter of fact, Symphony is no longer even on Avid's home product page. You have to first navigate to Media Composer, then you will see a link to Symphony on the bottom of the MC page. Hard to believe that's the exposure you would give to your finishing system. Not very reassuring.

    I hope Avid doesn't charge double (than MC5) the upgrade price for Symphony 5 like they did with V4. Can't really justify the price increase for the exact same features. I guess we will see what they do... 

    Mac Pro 2013 6 Core 3.5ghz, MC Symphony 8.7, 16GB RAM, D700, OS 10.10.5, Ultrastudio 4K, Pegasus2 R6 12TB [view my complete system specs]

     

    Derrick Abeyta | Blu Pixel

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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:41 PM In reply to

    • TCurren
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    editdudes:
    No argument there, but I'd be very interested in a link to some legal document explaining why you can't even answer questions about what major bugs are on your short list, or if we can expect CC masks in Symphony within a time frame of one, five or ten years.

     

    Companies don't like posting bugs as the competitors will use that against them. However, Search through these forums and you will se Avid recognizing and addressing many bugs. As for talking about future products, I believe you need to research Sarbanes-Oxley. As I understand it, if they announce future products, they can't recognize any profits until that product ships.

    http://www.soxlaw.com/

     

    editdudes:
    I'm a bit baffled by this, and I fail to see how Apple and others can circumvent these laws if you can't.

     

    This is where you baffle me. What product or feature has Apple ever announced ahead of an intended ship date? Of all the companies for you to pick as an example of "openness" Apple is the absolute worst at this. Don't believe me? I challenge you to find one employee of Apple who will say ANYTHING about any future release of product.

    Symphony Nitris Classic, Symphony DX, MC Soft, MC Adrenaline, MC Adrenaline HD, Unity, Terrablock, ProTools [view my complete system specs]

    Terence Curren Alpha Dogs, Inc.

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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:55 PM In reply to

    • editdudes
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    TCurren:

    editdudes, you are way off base here. If you don't think Avid is open enough, switch to Apple. 

    I deeply apologize to anyone that may be offended by this sentence, but that's the worst piece of cr#p comment I've ever heard from you.

    From my perspective, this is the best management, and the most customer interaction Avid has ever had. And yes, I too wish there were more for the Symphony. But I'm also a businessman, and I understand allocating resources for maximum return...

    Being a businessman myself (not by choice), I do understand your point. But AVID is just a company selling products we use to make a living. This is the bottom line, and if senior management is better or worse than before is utterly beside the point if the products we've paid top dollar for isn't evolving in a fashion that suits our expectations or needs.

    If this company doesn't realize that they should discuss their products in great detail with us or any other customer if and when we want to, then we're all in big trouble and AVID is in fact no better than APPLE.

    ...we just got a release that is exciting the majority of the user base. That is good for Avid and the benefit of that may be more users, more upgrades, equals more dollars available for R&D and more need for better finishing tools, and hopefully more money spent on Symphony development.

    This is a fair assumption, but as history has taught us it could also very well mean that the implementation of for example CC Masks will be delayed another ten years.

     

     

    Symphony Nitris DX • MC Adrenaline DNxcel 5.5 • DaVinci Resolve • VirtualDub :) [view my complete system specs]

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  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 4:59 PM In reply to

    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    Hi,

    Let's keep in mind that we're all professionals, and keep the discussion civil.

    thanks,
    Carl

    Media Composer 2019.8 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Envy 17t-j100 Quad Edition laptop, Windows 10 Pro, Intel Core i7 2.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, nVidia GeForce GT... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Thu, Apr 15 2010 5:10 PM In reply to

    • editdudes
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    Re: SYMPHONY = A B A N D O N W A R E

    BLKDOG:

    Here you go. This is the legal restraint on discussing unreleased features in US law. I'm not interested in debating any interpretations for this legal decision. Suffice to say that the people who sign our checks each week tell us how it will be interpreted.

    Thank you! Still baffled that senior management claim bugs can't be discussed due to legal reasons, but that's the Tewksbury way I guess.

    TCurren:

    What product or feature has Apple ever announced ahead of an intended ship date? Of all the companies for you to pick as an example of "openness" Apple is the absolute worst at this. Don't believe me? I challenge you to find one employee of Apple who will say ANYTHING about any future release of product.

    You're barking up the wrong tree here.

    Many new Apple products (iphone) and updates of current products (fcp) are leaked or hinted months and sometimes even a year before the intended shipping date, and on many occasions the actual release is then delayed by months.

    I have NEVER used Apple as an example of "openness". Why in the name of Jobs should I do that???

     

     

    Symphony Nitris DX • MC Adrenaline DNxcel 5.5 • DaVinci Resolve • VirtualDub :) [view my complete system specs]

    E D I T   D U D E S

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