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  • Sat, Jan 3 2009 2:05 AM

    • Marianna
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    Avid for Liquid Users: Lesson 7 - Long GOP problem /HDV to a QT-reference file

    The seventh in a series of tutorials created to assist Avid/Pinnacle Liquid users who are considering migrating to Media Composer.

    Many newcomers, myself included, come to MC with an HDV camera and capture through a firewire card.
    Then the first time they try to export a QT-reference file, up pops the dreaded "Long GOP" error message.

    Hope this helps!

    Regards,
    Douglas


    This tutorial can be viewed at "Full-screen" by clicking on the icon on the toolbar

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  • Tue, Jan 6 2009 2:54 AM In reply to

    • erpuig
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    Douglas, thank you for the many helpful files and tutorials, I am new on this forum.  This is a great method, but I have a question?

    I tried it and it works great, and the material works in DVDIt Pro HD etc., as I use the same workflow as your tutorials in the latter for Blue Ray creation etc.

    I had found a solution for the dreaded long GOP export HDV issue.  I do not recall where I found the method which I have used which I will describe briefly, and wonder if the end result of the Quick Time Reference export is the same as the method you use.

    I first duplicate my sequence also, then Transcode to DNxHD 145, which creates the assets as DNxHD 145 video, then replace the segments in the timeline, then export to Quick Time Ref with same parameters and settings.

    My question?  I wonder if the Video Mixdown (which ends up with a DNxHD 145 single video track) in your method, is the same as by going thru the transcode step? 

    It seems like your method (perhaps ) is better if there is no 'transcoding' taking place !!

    Is Video Mixdown the same as 'transcoding'  ?   Are the two methods arriving at the same quality end product sequence or is the Video Mixdown a better quality result?

    Your thoughts?

    Again, many thanks for the wonderful tutorials and great explanations.  I have viewed at least half of the videos you have created in my short time visiting this forum.

     

    Thanks again...

     

    Rick

  • Tue, Jan 6 2009 3:07 AM In reply to

    • Marianna
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    erpuig:
    Douglas, thank you for the many helpful files and tutorials, I am new on this forum.  This is a great method, but I have a question ..................I wonder if the Video Mixdown (which ends up with a DNxHD 145 single video track) in your method, is the same as by going thru the transcode step? Thanks again...
    Rick

    Thanks to you too, Rick

    I honestly cannot answer that question as a person who knows.
    But I can take a guess and say it should be the same process in both cases.
    If it is I would suggest you use the method you feel at ease with.

    If I am wrong (after all I am only human) I hope someone else will drop in and correct me.

    Regards,
    Douglas

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  • Tue, Jan 6 2009 3:18 AM In reply to

    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    "... I wonder if the Video Mixdown ... is the same as by going thru the transcode step? ..."

    Both methods create a new media file. Both methods convert Long GOP to a native Avid codec. I'm not sure if there is a significant difference in quality, but that's why they both work.

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  • Tue, Jan 6 2009 3:27 AM In reply to

    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    erpuig:
    I first duplicate my sequence also, then Transcode to DNxHD 145, which creates the assets as DNxHD 145 video, then replace the segments in the timeline, then export to Quick Time Ref with same parameters and settings.

    I hope you're not implying that you go through and manually replace the shots, because you know that by Transcoding you get a sequence with a ".Transcoded" suffix that will contain the same shots in whatever resolution you transcoded to?

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  • Tue, Jan 6 2009 4:43 AM In reply to

    • erpuig
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    I meant the latter, not replacing the segments, but as you stated, transcoding the sequence.  The end result is a sequence which can be exported to QTR without the long gop warning.  Thanks for correcting.

    My main question still remains, is there a quality difference? 

    I suspect the 'end product' is the same as far as quality of the video.  Could try short sequence with same segments, etc. both ways and see if files generated are identical (at file level) with Video Mixdown versus Transcode method.  If anyone can explain or knows for sure  would love to hear.  Probably academic. 

    I think Douglas' method is more elegant anyway.

    Thanks

    Rick

  • Mon, Mar 2 2009 5:02 AM In reply to

    • Wm.Busby
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    I know this thread is a a bit dated, but I just stumbled across it. Why go through the deleting tracks steps when all that would be needed would be to overwrite the original video tracks with the mixdown OR simply apply the mixdown to a top track & only select that track in the QT Ref dialog box?

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  • Mon, Mar 2 2009 5:12 AM In reply to

    • Marianna
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    Hello Bill,

    Good point!

    The answer is simply that I was a newcomer to MC at the same time as I began making the tutorials.
    If I had the time to redo the tutorial I would probably do as you suggested. Big Smile
    But as you may have noticed I am busy making new tutorials - about to begin number 90 later today!

    Regards,
    Douglas

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  • Wed, Apr 29 2009 3:44 PM In reply to

    • btwien
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    @ Douglas,

    Thanks for all your hard work...Trying to export my sequence in MC 2.8.4 I am getting the same error message.

    I can use this tutorial for MC too? Since you are using specific "Avid for Liquid users" in your title...

    Thanks!

    MC 5.5.3 Academic Version QT 7.7 Working with: PC, Windows 7, SP 1 Intel(R) Core(TM)i7 CPU 950 @3.07GHz 3.06 GHz NVIDIA Quadro 2000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Apr 29 2009 4:03 PM In reply to

    • Marianna
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    btwien:

    @ Douglas,

    Thanks for all your hard work...Trying to export my sequence in MC 2.8.4 I am getting the same error message.

    I can use this tutorial for MC too? Since you are using specific "Avid for Liquid users" in your title...

    Thanks!

    Ewien,
    This Tutorial is for MC.

    "Avid for Liquid Users" means it was made for Liquid users who were migrating to MC for the first time. But it can be used by anyone in MC.

    Regards,
    Douglas

     

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  • Wed, Apr 29 2009 6:58 PM In reply to

    • btwien
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    OK, sounds good! That is what I thought...

    I tested it with a small project and I have some specific questions if you don't mind:

    1)
    If I have 2 V-tracks, I'll duplicate - right mouse click - from V2 right to make it work?

    2)
    What QT reference settings do you prefere. I saw the tutorial where you did 8 diff. tests. I would like in the end to make a DVD of my project and distribute it.

    3)
    While doing the actual export, it gives me two diff. files: QT Movie (?) and WAV file..Why the WAV separated?

    Thanks again, you really helped me by making these tutorials.

    Ewien

     

    MC 5.5.3 Academic Version QT 7.7 Working with: PC, Windows 7, SP 1 Intel(R) Core(TM)i7 CPU 950 @3.07GHz 3.06 GHz NVIDIA Quadro 2000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Apr 30 2009 3:18 PM In reply to

    • btwien
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    @ Douglas and others...

    I tried the Video mix down this time with my project and it looks good (all effects in there), once I scroll through the project in my time line.

    Exporting goes well - NO ERROR - but it is going way to fast. In the end, I have a Sequence Quicktime of 206K (with no sound) and a separate WAV file...? What am I still doing wrong?

    Every help is appreciated!

    MC 5.5.3 Academic Version QT 7.7 Working with: PC, Windows 7, SP 1 Intel(R) Core(TM)i7 CPU 950 @3.07GHz 3.06 GHz NVIDIA Quadro 2000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Apr 30 2009 4:51 PM In reply to

    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    btwien:
    Exporting goes well - NO ERROR - but it is going way to fast. In the end, I have a Sequence Quicktime of 206K (with no sound) and a separate WAV file...? What am I still doing wrong?

    Probably nothing.

    You are exporting a QT reference, the resulting QT.mov is only a container that references the Avid media on your system.  That's why it is so small.  It's a fast export because it only has to create the container.  It also creates a separate audio file because you have chosen to export your audio as well.  

    The QTreference.mov file that you created will playback the audio when you launch it in QT Player and most times encoding apps/DVD authoring will only require you to use the .mov portion of the file.  Though, I like to convert my .wav to .ac3 for my DVDs.

    You say that your .mov has no sound... you're not hearing the audio when you play it through QT Player?

     

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  • Thu, Apr 30 2009 4:54 PM In reply to

    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    ugh... this Forum software!  Super Angry

    Only the word "reference" was supposed to be in BOLD.  I have attempted to edit the message and turn off the "bold" on the rest of that paragraph, and it shows it as normal.  I toggle on Bold and off again and re-post.  And it still shows up in BOLD!!!!  Super Angry

     

    Fixed it...  

    had to UnBold the whole thing and then Bold it after the fact.  It seems you can't type a word, make it bold, turn bold off and continue typing.  You have to type it all out first - then Bold select words. Hmm

     

    MacPro dual 2.66GHz 6GB RAM nVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT Storage: 2TB G-Speed eS with controller card 3x1TB Hitachi SATA-II internals, various external FW/USB... [view my complete system specs]

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  • Thu, Apr 30 2009 5:49 PM In reply to

    • btwien
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    Re: Log GOP problem when exporting HDV material to a QT-reference file

    @Kenton

    Thanks for your reply and explaining to me what the resulting QT.movie means.

    After some trials it did come with the sound too!

    Once I have this QT.mov and I would like to make DVD's out of it, how would that go?
    Quality is good enough for that? I need to convert my .wav to .ac3 for this, as you say right? Could I do this
    with any program (like Audacity)?

    Thanks a lot!

    MC 5.5.3 Academic Version QT 7.7 Working with: PC, Windows 7, SP 1 Intel(R) Core(TM)i7 CPU 950 @3.07GHz 3.06 GHz NVIDIA Quadro 2000 [view my complete system specs]
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