Latest post Thu, Jun 12 2008 5:34 PM by congaman. 36 replies.
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  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 7:22 AM In reply to

    • tawlif
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    Randall L Rike:

     

     

    I only challenge a post if I feel the statements made are a generalization, untrue, incomplete, or without proper documentation.

    BTW, my latest computer purchase was a MacBook Pro ... so, we're not in total disagreement.Yes

    Randall, please,  have pity on us

    enjoy your MacBookPro and let's not get off-topic each time.

    MacPro Dual 2.8GHz Xeon (Quad-core) Harpertown 14Gb MacOS 10.7.5 Media Composer/Symphony 7.0 [view my complete system specs]


  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 5:21 PM In reply to

    • Codec Moment
    • Top 500 Contributor
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    jasperfdo:
    I think MACs are cool and will probably move to one with the next system, but if you aren't in love with the MAC OS and just want to run Windows then I say "what's the point?"

    I didn't say I was going to run only windows on it. It I were only running windows I'd get a machine with comperable specs for 3/4 the price. I just said I'll probably run Avid more on the windows side because it has more features on that side and I don't have to worry about it getting messed up when I upgrade FCP and QT.

    Mac OSX 10.6.8 Avid Media Composer v6.0.1 Macbook Pro 2.5GHz Intel Core 2 Duo 2 GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM [view my complete system specs]

    I trust orange juice more than I trust most people.

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 6:50 PM In reply to

    • B.J. Ahlen
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    I run a PC and a Mac side-by-side in my daily work (with 3 NLEs), and have long experience with making sure that both types of machines are properly bought, configured, and cared for.

    Since 2006 at least, I have seen what most people have seen: cheap PCs cost less than cheap Macs.

    But I have also seen that when we leave the world of office supply store PCs and move into real workstations, the situation is different.

    At that level, Macs are often less expensive. Not always, but very often.

    Many workstation buyers have reported that when talking to Dell sales reps on the phone, all they had to do to get an immediate 25% discount was to say "Mac Pro."

    But even with that 25% discount, the price was still significantly higher than an equally configured Mac Pro.

    For heavy duty machines, any price comparison has to assume normal intelligence. You buy the minimum configurable amount of Apple RAM, and get the rest from OWC or other reputable vendor. You get the minimum hard drives installed, and if you want rocking performance you replace the OS drive with a $80 WD two-platter 640GB drive that is faster than the 10,000 rpm Raptors I have in my Supermicro workstation. Unless you're only working on external SATA RAIDs, you put in the best media drives of the month from reputable manufacturers (this month it's WD, it used to be Seagate before they seemingly lost control of their China manufacturer's QC).

    And of course you use your NAPP (National Association of Photoshop Professionals, at www.photoshopuser.com) 8-17% discount when buying from Apple or one of NAPP's other hardware partners.

    It is no surprise to me that Apple now has a 66% market share in the over $1,000 computer segment where we editors operate.

    I do like HP's workstations such as the xw8400, but "less expensive" is not what comes to mind here.

    Any editor who is not an "under-the-hood" guy or gal should spend more time on finding the right full service local reseller to work with, rather than worrying so much about "which is better, PC or Mac?" (at least when it comes to MC use).

    The national "onsite service and support" plans from the major manufacturers don't exactly have superior customer satisfaction. The best of them are just a bit better than, "OK, so the DVD tray won't pop out. Have you tried reformatting the hard drive and installing everything from scratch?," or "So there is no audio coming out of your um, computer speakers (aka "Genelec nearfield monitors")? Have you tried reformatting the hard drive and installing everything from scratch?," etc.

    A truly knowledgable local reseller is worth gold when it comes to feeling confident about your uptime in case of any last minute problems just before a critical delivery.

    If you can't get that, at least get two systems so you have an immediate backup to save your sanity.

    And if you use Macs, do spend $130 on Applecare (the eBay price from reputable sources; full price from Apple is about $250 less discounts).

     

    Media Composer 3.0, HP xw8600 w/Quadro 3700, Mac Pro 8-core 10GB, MacBook Pro OS X 10.4, AJA IO, DL Extreme HD&SD, 4TB RAID, FCS2, Adobe Master Collection... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 7:05 PM In reply to

    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    Hi,

    Good post, B.J.  Welcome to the show.

    B.J. Ahlen:
    For heavy duty machines, any price comparison has to assume normal intelligence.

    You're new here, so I'm gonna let that one go.  After a while on these forums, you will learn not to assume normal intelligence.  Cool

    good luck,
    Carl

    Media Composer 2020.9 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Z-Book G6 17", i7-9850H 2.60GHz, 32gb RAM, NVIDIA Quadro RTX 3000, Windows 10 Pro [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 7:10 PM In reply to

    • Baklap
    • Top 25 Contributor
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    • Moderator: Avid Xpress Pro PC

    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    B.J. Ahlen:

    Many workstation buyers have reported that when talking to Dell sales reps on the phone, all they had to do to get an immediate 25% discount was to say "Mac Pro."

    But even with that 25% discount, the price was still significantly higher than an equally configured Mac Pro.

    The funny thing is.. over here we get a fully configured XW 8600 HP with 3 year onsite for less then a comparible Mac Pro system.. so weird those price differences..

    Btw it is always bad to just consider price.. go with what suits you.. you want flexibility and more apps and are prepared to pay for that in security issues (when you are not treating your machine as it should) then PC is the way to go (not any PC i mean a real good PC) and if you want security and the feel and looks and stability of a Mac.. well them mac is the way.

    Sit at them both and feel the difference.. i am lost at a man but that does not mean i will never own one.. as someone said earlier on the L2 .."i get what suits me"

    Menno

     

     

    35+ MC's - 224TB Isis - 2.2 PB Spectra T950 - Interplay - 2 Media Central's - 3 TM's - 2 STP's - 500 TB Isilon - 2 Vantage - MOG SPeedrail... [view my complete system specs]

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    "If you do what you did you will get what you got!"

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  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 8:11 PM In reply to

    • B.J. Ahlen
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    camoscato:
    You're new here, so I'm gonna let that one go.  After a while on these forums, you will learn not to assume normal intelligence.  Cool

    He-he, I understand, Carl. That just came from being raised to be frugal, can't help it.

    I still buy summer clothes in the fall and winter gear in the spring, including buying my favorite [normally outrageously expensive] ski jacket at a Heathrow airport gift shop in May, hoo-hooo Big Smile).

    Generally speaking I tend to be well informed about where to get the best prices from reputable vendors, so if I can help somebody here, just holler.

    I like building up long term vendor relationships. That actually has value (other than with most banks that seem to have replaced most of their knowledgable staff with droids).

     

     

    Media Composer 3.0, HP xw8600 w/Quadro 3700, Mac Pro 8-core 10GB, MacBook Pro OS X 10.4, AJA IO, DL Extreme HD&SD, 4TB RAID, FCS2, Adobe Master Collection... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 9:09 PM In reply to

    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    But I have also seen that when we leave the world of office supply store PCs and move into real workstations, the situation is different.

     

    .- It depends on where and how you buy your PC workstations.

    You'd be surprised of the bargains and HUGE price differences you can find if you look a little bit more.

     

     

    Lenovo E32 ThinkStation Intel Xeon E3-1245,16GB RAM, Nvidia Quadro 600 (1 GB), Windows 10 Pro x64 (up to date) USB 3.0, Lite-On SSD 256GB System Drive... [view my complete system specs]

    Remembering my friend Larry Rubin

    "Art can't exist without Craft"

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 11:00 PM In reply to

    • luca.mg
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    B.J.: I do agree with You, for top of the line workstations a Mac is more affordable than a Dell/HP nowdays, and I want to add that even a DIY twin processor box will cost You more than a Dell anyway;

    Larry: the Avid-Apple love affair went to an end when Microsoft bought quite a few Avid's shares (what a coincidence).

    Symphony 20.9, BM Intensity Pro 4k, Windows 10, i7-5930K, 32 GB ram, Quadro K620 [view my complete system specs]

    peace luca

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 11:12 PM In reply to

    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    luca.mg:
    the Avid-Apple love affair went to an end when Microsoft bought quite a few Avid's shares (what a coincidence
     

    True, however is was VERY interesting to follow the Avid/Apple high stakes poker game as it unfolded at the time.  Like they say, you've got to know when to hold and when to fold. And it's really not surprising that Bill Gates would invest in a competitor to Apple.

    Newscutter Nitris DX 9.5.3.5 * Media Composer 5.5.3.6 (At Home on PC running XP Pro) * Symphony 6.5.2.1 (At home on MacBook Pro3,1 running 10.7.2) * Interplay... [view my complete system specs]

    Larry Rubin

    Senior Editor

    The Pentagon Channel

    www.pentagonchannel.mil

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 11:24 PM In reply to

    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    Larry Rubin:
    really not surprising that Bill Gates would invest in a competitor to Apple.
    But the oft forgotten part is the $100+ Million he invested in Apple to get it through tough times and allowed the ipod cash cow to develop.

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 11:34 PM In reply to

    • luca.mg
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    When Bill Gates invested in Avid FinalCut was not born yet: Apple was not a competitor at the time. It's not that surprising that Bill Gates kept Apple alive: Microsoft has to have Apple in business to avoid being sanctioned as a monopolist .

    Symphony 20.9, BM Intensity Pro 4k, Windows 10, i7-5930K, 32 GB ram, Quadro K620 [view my complete system specs]

    peace luca

  • Wed, Jun 11 2008 11:46 PM In reply to

    • jasperfdo
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    luca.mg:

    Microsoft has to have Apple in business to avoid being sanctioned as a monopolist .

    Very true.  Now we need Microsoft to dump some serious cash back into Avid.

    MacBook Pro Retina / El Capitan / 16GB RAM / G-Studio Drive System / Media Composer 8.6.x [view my complete system specs]

    kyler boudreau | www.theatereleven.com

     

     

  • Thu, Jun 12 2008 10:48 AM In reply to

    • congaman
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    I think BJ and Menno's replies are correct. Finding a good local reseller who can sort out problems quickly and efficiently is probably more important than the PC vs Mac discussion. I'm fortunate that in London we have at least three resellers. And I need to know that the ones that I'll contact are experienced in both PC and Mac platforms, so that they can give me as much impartial advice as possible.

    Investing £6k (computer, MC upgrade, Mojo SDI and some eSATA storage) is a lot of money for a small company like ours, so I need to know that it is money wisely spent.

    Thanks for all your comments so far.

    All the best. Chris.

  • Thu, Jun 12 2008 12:38 PM In reply to

    • berga
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    B.J. Ahlen:

    But I have also seen that when we leave the world of office supply store PCs and move into real workstations, the situation is different.

     

     Not surprisingly Mac is cheaper at least here. You can only get Nvidia GVS card with macs, not quadro cards, that a lot of the cost of a workstation.

    And as oppersite to Your experience, Dells telephone and on-site support is very good here. They have help me lots, with both workstations and servers. I call them, and if we can not fix the problem at tele, I have a service technican at my office within 24h with spare parts and they fix the computer. This is worth lots of money then the deadline is approaching fast.

    HP xw4600, 3.2Mhz, 4Gb RAM, Mojo. 500GB SATA Bootdrive, 3x500GB internal raid-0 for video, Windows 7 Pro Swedish, MC7 with Symphony option, Blackmagic... [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Jun 12 2008 12:59 PM In reply to

    • congaman
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    Re: PC vs Mac - the latest views

    If I went the PC route, here in the UK the PC of choice would be the HP xw8600 which I would spec with 3 year 4 hour call out warranty. My reseller's recommendation is the HP becuase of the close relationship between Avid, Microsoft and HP (even cross-ownership of shares).

    Chris

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