Latest post Fri, Jan 22 2016 2:34 PM by pierreh. 5 replies.
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  • Wed, Mar 4 2015 9:35 PM

    • BrettG
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    New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    Hi all,

    I've been exploring the forum researching this one, but cannot seem to find the exact answer I'm looking for. I was hoping for some help on a 4K project workflow.

    We have existing DNxHD 220 footage imported into a 1080 HD project. The client needs their master in 1080 HD. However, more footage will be coming in from a RED camera at 4K. We plan to work with both of these resolutions and finish in HD. My plan was to AMA link all of the 4K footage then transcode that footage to the DNxHD codec. However, the client would also like the raw 4K files, and the option down the line, to output a 4K master. And, some of the 4K footage has mixed frame rates. What to do? Should I transcode to the new DNxHR codec for the mixed frame rates? How would that effect mixing with the previously imported DNxHD footage and an HD finish? Also, would we still be able to AMA link back to ALL of the original 4K footage for a 4K output when the time comes? I'm a little confused by all of this. We are also mastering via an Avid Nitris which I feel might be a no go with DNxHR.

    Thanks a million for any responses. 

     

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  • Thu, Mar 5 2015 12:45 PM In reply to

    • cuervo
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    Re: New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    You can injest the 4k footage in a 4K project; then, open up a new HD project and bring in the bin(s) from the 4k project. You can then output from whichever project is appropriate, HD or 4K.

    SYS1:ASUS Z97, Haswell 4.0GHz CPU, 32GB RAM, Quadro 4200 + GTX1070, Thunderbolt II -DNxIO-FSI CM171 ///SYS2:ASUS Maximus Extreme V, Sandy Bridge 3.1GHz... [view my complete system specs]

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  • Thu, Mar 5 2015 3:12 PM In reply to

    • Cam
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    Re: New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    Is there a way to output 4K DNxHR QT files?  I don't seem to have that option.  Can do 4K Prores QTs.

    iMac 5K 27" Late 2015, 4ghz Intel Core i7, 32gb ram, AMD Radeon R9 M395x 4gb / Media Composer with Symphony option - 8.5.3 / El Capitan - 10.11.3 [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Mar 6 2015 8:40 PM In reply to

    • BrettG
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    Re: New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    Got it! Thanks for the reply, Cuervo.

    I assume this will not work out if we are mastering to tape via an Avid Nitris? Although, we are possibly planning on purchasing the Blackmagic UltraStudio 4K Box. Which would handle 4K and DNxHR outputs, I assume. And mixed 4K frame-rates? Not a problem if we just import into a uniform DNxHR codec in a 4K project? Also... our client would also like all of the 4K footage as HD .mov files for future third-party licensing. I assume I can output those from the 4K project as well? 

    Thanks again.

  • Fri, Mar 6 2015 10:34 PM In reply to

    • cuervo
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    Re: New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    I can't speak to what workflows are available thru Nitris. Ay this point in time, Avid has not ported DNxHR over to Quicktime. But, I would assume that's coming, as well as a SDK for 3rd party vendors, like AJA and BMD. I'm sure that as soon as the SDK is made available to license, we'll see the kind of support we're currently getting from Resolve. But, I'm only guessing about that. I have no vision to the inner workings at Avid.

    SYS1:ASUS Z97, Haswell 4.0GHz CPU, 32GB RAM, Quadro 4200 + GTX1070, Thunderbolt II -DNxIO-FSI CM171 ///SYS2:ASUS Maximus Extreme V, Sandy Bridge 3.1GHz... [view my complete system specs]

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  • Fri, Jan 22 2016 2:34 PM In reply to

    • pierreh
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    Re: New DNxHR codec, 4K footage, master in HD, workflow question

    I came across that thread as I'm just finishing the edit of a project on which the assistant did all the preparation ahead of me even being hired. So we never got to think the workflow before it all started - actually, I didn't even meet her. We're finishing the film with a different person. Possible recipe for disaster, but if we're careful now, we should be fine. I also posted to the Avid-L with little luck so far.

    Nevertheless, there are some areas that I need to clarify before we dive into conforming the project.

    First thing first: we're on Media Composer 8.4.4.

    The project is a historical documentary about the 100th anniversary of the Dublin 1916 Rising, and therefore contains a lot of archive material. Most of it came as 4:3 SD. The interviews were shot with a Sony F55, mostly in HD, but some footage (about 1% of the finished film) was shot in U-HD. All the material, archives as well as original, is at 25fps.

    The assistant first created a UHD project in order to retain the original frame size of the footage. The footage was brought in via AMA Link, then transcoded to DNxHR HQ. The idea was to skip a conform at the end of editing. Then the project was switched to HD/Rec709, and the archive footage (low res SD with BiTC) was AMA linked and transcoded to DNxHD120 - which was overkill since it came as low-res MP4 files.

    All the sound for the new footage was synch'ed up in that HD project. That project is the one I used to edit the two films. Since it's a HD project, any material I bring in can only be converted/rendered to DNxHD. 

    Colour grading asked for a QuickTime file with an EDL to spot each cut. I would like to be able to deliver the film to them in DNxHR since the original material is in that codec. Also, since the archive that's in the film will be delivered to us as hi-res SD QuickTime, we decided to upscale it to HD outside of Avid and AMA Link it. We will upscale it to 1920x1434 (not 1080 since it's 4:3), and then use Frameflex to do the top and bottom cropping that will be required to deliver a 1920x1080 master.

    Now the questions are: 

    - How do I get the project to a DNxHR environment? Do I have to switch to a UHD project even though I'm delivering HD size, or can I just create a custom size project and make it 1920x1080? Or should I just keep my HD project and transcode the original footage to DNxHD?

    - The original footage has a Color Effect added by MediaComposer (based on the camera LUT) but the archive footage is just regular video with no LUT. When I export the film for the colour grader, do I remove the Color Effect to go back to the washed out non-LUT footage? Or should I export two QuickTime files, one for the original material and one for the archive material?

     

    Update: I did some test as knowledge on DNxHR seems rare these days.

    If I switch my project to UHD, I can indeed export "Same As Source" in DNxHR - great. BUT... my sequence is now exported as UHD - i.e. 3840x2160 - where most of my material is HD, and my delivery is HD too. I could find a way to export in HD from that UHD project, or export in DNxHR from a HD project. I tried to make a Custom Size project and make it 1920x1080 but the Avid spotted me trying to trick it and gave me only DNxHD resolutions as a reprisal action... Back in my HD project, I was able to Ama Link my 4x3 footage (1920x1434) and shift up or down to reframe it within my 16:9 window. That's the good news. So now I'm back to decision mode and I'm thinking about rendering the archive footage in ProRes HQ (bit overkill, I know) and Transcoding the existing original material from DNxHR to ProRes HQ. ProRes is not limited to 1920x1080 like DNxHD. That way I'll be able to export ProRes material for the colorist. Seems a bit complicated, but so far it's the only way I can see. Happy to hear your experience with DNxHR if you have any!

    Thanks for reading!

    Pierre

    - Work: MacPro 2010 3.46Ghz 12 Cores 48Gig mem, int and ext Raids, Mojo DX, 10.12.6 - Home: MacBookPro 2.5Ghz quad-i7, 16Gig Mem and SSD OSX 10.9.5 [view my complete system specs]
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